#170 - Mike & Kass Lazerow Return — “Shoveling Sh*t” and the Truth About Building Companies Together

Jan 26, 2026

*Quick Note: Audio quality varies in parts of this episode. We chose to share it anyway because the conversation was too valuable to hold back. Thanks for listening. 

Mike and Kass Lazerow return to The Necessary Entrepreneur for their second appearance with host Mark Perkins, delivering another candid, no-BS conversation about the realities of entrepreneurship, leadership, and long-term success.

As serial entrepreneurs, investors, and co-founders of Buddy Media, acquired by Salesforce, Mike and Kass bring hard-earned perspective from decades of building, scaling, and enduring inside high-stakes businesses. In this episode, they expand on the themes from their book Shoveling $h!t: A Love Story, digging deeper into why entrepreneurship is often uncomfortable, emotionally demanding, and misunderstood by those who only see the upside.

The conversation revisits lessons from helping grow Golf.com, navigating major exits, and the identity shifts that come after “winning.” Mark, Mike, and Kass explore why resilience, self-awareness, and emotional durability matter more than raw intelligence, and why most people underestimate the personal cost of building something meaningful, especially when you’re doing it alongside a spouse or long-term partner.

This return episode goes further than their first appearance, tackling what happens after success: reinvention, burnout, ego management, and how founders recalibrate their definition of achievement once the scoreboard resets. It’s an honest look at entrepreneurship without hype, shortcuts, or motivational fluff.

Essential listening for founders, CEOs, operators, and entrepreneurs who want substance over soundbites, and the truth about what it really takes to last.

Topics covered include:

• Why Mike & Kass returned to The Necessary Entrepreneur

• Lessons since their first appearance on the show

• Building Buddy Media and selling to Salesforce

• Early growth insights from Golf.com

• Inside Shoveling $h!t: A Love Story

• Founder resilience, identity, and reinvention

• Marriage, partnership, and entrepreneurship

• Redefining success after an exit

🎙️ The Necessary Entrepreneur is hosted by Mark Perkins and features in-depth conversations with experienced founders and operators focused on long-term value, not hype.

📌 Connect With Us:
Website: https://www.thenecessaryentrepreneur.com/
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@thenecessaryentrepreneur
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/thenecessaryentrepreneur/
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/TheNecessaryEntrepreneurPod
X (Formerly Twitter): https://twitter.com/MPerkinsTNE
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/tnepod/
TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@tneclips
Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/6xhGUE1yzy2N0AemUOlJPx?si=d1c5c316af404f15
Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/no/podcast/the-necessary-entrepreneur/id1547181167

📌 Find Out More About Kass and Mike:
https://kassandmike.com/
https://www.instagram.com/kassandmike/
https://www.facebook.com/kassandmike
https://www.tiktok.com/@kassandmikeofficial
www.youtube.com/@KassandMike

📘 Order Shoveling $h!t: A Love Story Here